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HANNAH CROSBIE: How’s the jetlag doing?
TROYE SIVAN: Genuinely fine. I woke up at six today, and yesterday just before five, so it’s getting better.
CROSBIE: What’s your go-to jet lag cure?
SIVAN: I try not to nap for the first day.
CROSBIE: That’s hardcore.
SIVAN: It’s a hard rule. Even if it’s just melatonin, I’ll take something for the first three nights. Even if I feel exhausted, if I wake up at four, I can’t get back to sleep.
CROSBIE: Honestly, American melatonin was such a game changer for me when I first went over and discovered CVS. I found those insanely good red gummies.
SIVAN: Oh my god, they’re so delicious.
CROSBIE: They shouldn’t be that delicious. What are your fashion week plans?
SIVAN: Nothing really, I’m just in town to throw this party for Penfolds tonight.
CROSBIE: That’s why I’m here. I write about youth culture and drinking a lot and how they fit together. Or how wines and spirits are trying to fit into the constantly shifting tastes of our generation. Booze is my job now but I have such a different relationship to it than when I was growing up.
SIVAN: When I think about what wine means to me now, it’s all about community and connection. You know what I mean?
CROSBIE: I do.
SIVAN: My point of inspiration for so many things is a beautiful, sunny afternoon in Melbourne, sitting with friends in a park, and opening a bottle of wine. Wine bar culture in Melbourne is so incredible, those days when people are pouring out into the streets and everyone is so connected, having a gorgeous time together and making really special moments. I love a three-hour dinner.
CROSBIE: I often talk about connectivity through drinking. This idea of not going out and using alcohol as a tool to get drunk or party, but using it as a tool to connect with people.
SIVAN: Totally.
CROSBIE: Wine is totally unique in this way. If you open a beer, you’re having one beer to yourself. If you order a cocktail, you’re having a cocktail that’s just yours. Wine is something that you inherently share. But there’s also this different way you can find connection through wine. In the UK, where I live, I always say we’re a nation of drinkers rather than producers.
SIVAN: Right.
CROSBIE: But someone like you who’s born in South Africa and brought up in Australia, you have that connection to wine that I almost wouldn’t even be able to begin to understand. I talk to my French friends about how when you’re from a winemaking country, how much a part of your life that industry is.
SIVAN: I’m just so proud of anything Australian. Let me give you an example. The other day it happened with this actress in The Pitt.
CROSBIE: Oh my god, I wanted to talk to you about this.
SIVAN: I found out she was from Adelaide, and I freaked out.
CROSBIE: You said on Instagram you couldn’t leave the house because you truly believed you worked in an ER.
SIVAN: Truly. I feel like I’m in that TV show now because of her. I just get so proud of good Australian things, especially when it’s on a global scale. It’s true for wine as well. For me, growing up and even seeing ‘Margaret River’ on a bottle, which is a town I grew up four hours away from, makes me really, really proud. I feel like it’s something we do very well. It’s very chic.
CROSBIE: This is the thing we need to find. Because everything I read at the moment is telling me that young people aren’t drinking anymore. I’m always trying to make the case that they are, but instead of cheaper and worse, it’s something a bit more elevated, with a story behind it. We’re still drinking, but we’re choosing our moments.
SIVAN: One thing that’s been fun about getting older is having those moments where we enjoy a really good meal with delicious wine. Nothing makes me feel so good. I walk away from those nights feeling genuinely fulfilled. Especially with how much time we all spend on our own these days. It’s the antidote to all that.
CROSBIE: I’ve been thinking a lot about being truly present when it’s so easy to fall back into your phone. Especially since COVID where we all had to become immediately self-sufficient, and then we went back out to discover these experiences hospitality can give us, it became even more special.
SIVAN: Totally. It’s always such a yawn when somebody takes out their phone at dinner. Then other people take out their phones around them, it just becomes a moment for everyone to go on their phone.
CROSBIE: Yeah. I’d obviously love to know where you love to eat, but I also don’t want to doxx your favourite restaurants. [Laughs] I guess what I really want to know is what you look for in a perfect wine bar.
SIVAN: To be honest, I couldn’t tell you a single name of a restaurant in Paris, because I get guided by my fashion friends who just take me to these chic places where the wine is good and the ambience is amazing. One thing that I really care about is a personable sommelier.
CROSBIE: I have thoughts on this.
SIVAN: It’s really important to have someone explain the wine to you where it doesn’t really matter your level of previous knowledge. I really admire people who can dispel some of the intimidation people can feel from wine. That’s what I want to do when I’m talking about wine.
CROSBIE: There’s still this snooty sommelier myth.
SIVAN: Exactly.
CROSBIE: Like, they’ve lovingly put the list together, they would love nothing more than to talk about it with you and match you with the perfect bottle of wine.
SIVAN: No, I always ask. It’s part of the experience, part of the fun, part of the show.
CROSBIE: I completely agree.
SIVAN: And then the music has to be good.
CROSBIE: What kind of music?
SIVAN: It depends. One of my favorite things to do in L.A. is go to Korean barbecue. There’s this place, I don’t remember the name, but they play very loud, very intense K-pop and Korean dance music, and it puts me in the best mood. The dinner feels completely unhinged by the end. [Laughs] You’re dancing, drinking, and then cooking your own food? It’s very fun.
CROSBIE: I just wrote a column on this. It started off as a completely different piece. I wanted to write about playlist curation in restaurants and so many people told me you can almost predict exactly how customers will order when you play different music. La Camionera, this iconic lesbian bar in London, told me that reggaeton makes people buy palomas, red wine if they play jazz. Music becomes this thing that guides the evening along.
SIVAN: That’s super, super interesting.
CROSBIE: What are you doing this evening?
SIVAN: Oh, I’m doing this really chic dinner, all my beautiful fashion friends are here because it is Paris Fashion Week. Nice wine, nice people, and I’m gonna be showing Aussie wines I’m really proud of: it’s what I love to do.
CROSBIE: I’ll be there. [Laughs]
SIVAN: Yeah, me too.
CROSBIE: Thanks for your time, darling. I’ll see you later.
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